Net Neutrality

[Anikal]

What do you think? Just curious about other people's views on it.

I doubt that the so called "takeover" of the internet by giant companies will ever happen: There are simply too many people connected to the Internet.

Discuss your views on the subject.

http://www.savetheinternet.com/ for more information.

[Inactive Cargo]

I don't think anyone particularly gives a fuck, not with Internet 2 "around the corner", and by "around the corner" I mean "by the time any shit can happen, iSQUARED will be out".

[Slevin57]

Well technically the internet is already owned by Giant companies, they just don't regulate it, yet. I don't think they will ever regulate the content, but I think they may attempt to charge usage rates one day. I think AT&T owns most of the lines that the internet is transversed over.

[Confero]

I called both of my senators and left a few messages about this months ago =D

[Kinetix]

If someone tries to watch me, regulate me, enforce laws on the internet and oppress me I will fight. I will revolt.

Here in America we have no free speech. "Domestic spying" as the NSA likes to call it (believe it or not kids who copy and paste the media's opinion (aka. Lazz) it's not bush who proposed it, it was the NSA) prevents us from saying anything and violates our constitution rights. We can't visit certain news sites without sending red flags to the agency. We can't download without worrying about being watched. We can't post on blogs without the worry we could be marked as terrorists. What we say on our cell phones albeit this rarely happens, but they CAN and WILL listen in on your calls. Especially if you red flag.

The internet is the last line of freedom of speech. If companies and corporations try and control it we will fight, and we will win.

The thing that is often brought up in these debates is "I'm not a pirate/terrorist. I'm not doing anything wrong. You should only worry about domestic spying if your doing something wrong". This is fallacy. If you believe this please go hang yourself for the better of the world. It is far beyond what you are, or what you have done. It's your privacy. How would you like it if someone was watching you piss through a small camera, reading what's on your news paper in a starbucks to make sure you aren't a "terrorist". You have nothing to worry about though right? I mean you've never done anything wrong right? This may be right. But the government makes mistakes. All the time. One night someone uses your internet (LAN, or WAN) and sends up a red flag because they did something wrong. Next morning your house is surrounded and next thing you know you have a boot to the back of your neck and your being read your miranda rights. But you've never done anything wrong right? They'll work it out. The bad guy will be caught. Right? Maybe. But nothing will EVER remove the sight of you being hauled out of your house hastily for questioning because you are a "suspected terrorist". Nothing will change what your neighbors saw, and now think of you because of this. The government won't fix that. That is why you should be worried.

But alas, they can't do it. There is no physically possible way to regulate the internet and it's contents. One country, one nation can NEVER impose laws that spread throughout the internet. The internet is international. The internet is determined the same way pirates that sit on international borders are. Countries can't touch what's in international waters. This goes doubly for the internet.

However the internet can't be free. Slevin is right to a point and wrong the rest of the way. ISPs are giant corporations. They run and regulate the internet. Now, they CAN impose rules and regs about what you can and can't do because it is their connection and their bandwidth. Just like if you have someone staying over at your house. You can tell them you can't do this, or that, and they are forced to follow. But corporations that try and fight and conglomerate the internet will never succeed. There is too much paper work.


When internet 2 comes out i'll go back to HAM radio and pay phones.


Viva la net neutrality.

[Slevin57]

For the people, by the people of the people.

Government leaders are not in some elitist social class or royal family. They are people just like you and me. This idea that our government is out their plotting against normal citizens is the remnants of the time of the great empires.

Say for instance I was planning on blowing up the |1337| House. I would know for one, not to directly refer to this over any lines of communication. Hey Avarik guess what I'm gonna blow up the |1337| House, because the people that work for President Runestone will get that flag and have the FBI on my ass before I have a chance to have breakfast. Provided that they happen to be listening to me.

The point is terrorists and criminals know the government has the capacity to monitor these things. Corporations have been working with the government on this for a long time, it's common knowledge at this point.

The NSA is not authorized by congress to monitor domestic calls. They monitor calls from overseas to the US and vice versa.

If you are calling overseas to your friend Lazz in Australia and tell him you are planning to blow up the |1337| House, that's the kind of conversation the NSA should, would and wants to monitor.

NOBODY GIVES A FUCK ABOUT THE CALLS TO YOUR GRANDMA.

I would venture to say that monitoring phone calls would be among the most boring jobs on the planet.

"Let's Revolt!" This is one of the arguments I love from the 2nd amendment people.

If you live in America....

Look at your personal defense and look at the offense of your country. You do not stand a flying fucking chance against your own military. You might have alot of guns and probably enough ammo to defend yourself against civilian attackers, but if I roll up in an A1-M1 Abrams tank and use my forward cannon to lock onto your heat signature you won't even have a chance to load that rusty shot gun you haven't cleaned since college.

Besides, if there was a revolt, I'm almost positive I'd be on the side that has the armored divisions. :P

[Kinetix]

For the people, by the people of the people.

Government leaders are not in some elitist social class or royal family. They are people just like you and me. This idea that our government is out their plotting against normal citizens is the remnants of the time of the great empires.

Say for instance I was planning on blowing up the |1337| House. I would know for one, not to directly refer to this over any lines of communication. Hey Avarik guess what I'm gonna blow up the |1337| House, because the people that work for President Runestone will get that flag and have the FBI on my ass before I have a chance to have breakfast. Provided that they happen to be listening to me.

The point is terrorists and criminals know the government has the capacity to monitor these things. Corporations have been working with the government on this for a long time, it's common knowledge at this point.

The NSA is not authorized by congress to monitor domestic calls. They monitor calls from overseas to the US and vice versa.

If you are calling overseas to your friend Lazz in Australia and tell him you are planning to blow up the |1337| House, that's the kind of conversation the NSA should, would and wants to monitor.

NOBODY GIVES A FUCK ABOUT THE CALLS TO YOUR GRANDMA.

I would venture to say that monitoring phone calls would be among the most boring jobs on the planet.

"Let's Revolt!" This is one of the arguments I love from the 2nd amendment people.

If you live in America....

Look at your personal defense and look at the offense of your country. You do not stand a flying fucking chance against your own military. You might have alot of guns and probably enough ammo to defend yourself against civilian attackers, but if I roll up in an A1-M1 Abrams tank and use my forward cannon to lock onto your heat signature you won't even have a chance to load that rusty shot gun you haven't cleaned since college.

Besides, if there was a revolt, I'm almost positive I'd be on the side that has the armored divisions. :P

No one stands a chance against a army. I wasn't asking for a revolution. I would just stand along side anyone who is defending the freedom of the internet.

If you read the patriot act you would realize that the NSA has permission to monitor calls in the borders as well as outside of them. This is because if you plan on blowing something up and you call someone in America from America then you'll flag just as fast, if not faster than when you flag for a outbound call.


The NSA covers NATIONAL SECURITY. Which applys to both inside and outside the US.

[KMFD]

I've never heard of this internet 2, but I'm liking the idea. What's gonna be better about it?

[Slevin57]

No one stands a chance against a army. I wasn't asking for a revolution. I would just stand along side anyone who is defending the freedom of the internet.

If you read the patriot act you would realize that the NSA has permission to monitor calls in the borders as well as outside of them. This is because if you plan on blowing something up and you call someone in America from America then you'll flag just as fast, if not faster than when you flag for a outbound call.


The NSA covers NATIONAL SECURITY. Which applys to both inside and outside the US.

Um no?

"National Security Agency/Central Security Service (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Security_Service) (NSA/CSS) is the U.S. government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_of_the_United_States)'s cryptologic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptology) organization. Officially established on November 4 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_4), 1952 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1952), it is believed to be the world's largest intelligence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligence_%28information_gathering%29)-gathering agency. Responsible for the collection and analysis of foreign communications (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communication), it coordinates, directs, and performs highly specialized activities to produce foreign signals intelligence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signals_intelligence) information, which involves a significant amount of cryptanalysis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptanalysis). It is also responsible for protecting U.S. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S.) government communications from similar agencies elsewhere, which involves a significant amount of cryptography (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptography)."

[Kinetix]

Um no?

"National Security Agency/Central Security Service (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Security_Service) (NSA/CSS) is the U.S. government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_of_the_United_States)'s cryptologic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptology) organization. Officially established on November 4 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_4), 1952 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1952), it is believed to be the world's largest intelligence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligence_%28information_gathering%29)-gathering agency. Responsible for the collection and analysis of foreign communications (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communication), it coordinates, directs, and performs highly specialized activities to produce foreign signals intelligence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signals_intelligence) information, which involves a significant amount of cryptanalysis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptanalysis). It is also responsible for protecting U.S. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S.) government communications from similar agencies elsewhere, which involves a significant amount of cryptography (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptography)."

NSA would still control the internet regardless. Since we are making foreign communication. However that article is misleading. There is more the to NSA than that. That's just the jist of it.

[Slevin57]

It's wikipedia what do you expect :P

[KMFD]

Never trust wikipedia. Anyone can post anything on there. I could say that Earth is the 7th planet from the sun and quite frankly 1/1000000 people would believe me.

I could say that Jack Bauer is a real person.

I could say carbon is the first element on the periodic table.

I could say that Tiger Woods is gay.

Doesn't mean it is all true.

[runestone]

That's right. Most think the iPod is a great purchase and can't wait to buy an iPhone simply because Steve Jobs told them via an advertisement on the Internet.

The reality is it's a piece of over-priced, over-rated crap.

[KMFD]

I love my ipod. Great purchase.
I phone looks kinda weird, but w/e.

[Anikal]

The reality is it's a piece of over-priced, over-rated crap.

Absolutely true. Apple won't do well with it's iPhone.

[Shins]

The reality is it's a piece of over-priced, over-rated crap.

Reality is a commodity.

[Slevin57]

Reality is a comedy.

Fix'D:P

[Kinetix]

Reality is a commodity.

I saw that Colbert report and was about to post that. But it didn't let me ;-;

[Confero]

This way of thinking is underground, it's 1337. The mainstream loves their iPods which break in a few months (personal experience) or their iPhone that will be replaced by the iMazing or something shortly after.

[Anikal]

This way of thinking is underground, it's 1337. The mainstream loves their iPods which break in a few months (personal experience) or their iPhone that will be replaced by the iMazing or something shortly after.

iFone.

[Tangent]

I've never heard of this internet 2, but I'm liking the idea. What's gonna be better about it?

This time around, it won't function like a big truck. It'll be more like a series of tubes.

[Kinetix]

This way of thinking is underground, it's 1337. The mainstream loves their iPods which break in a few months (personal experience) or their iPhone that will be replaced by the iMazing or something shortly after.

I have a iPod video. Granted I'm no zealot I've dropped it and nothing has broken. Why, do you like the Zune's DRM policy?

[Hazaro]

I want faster, cheaper internet. I don't want to be watched.

[goregasm]

I could say that Jack Bauer is a real person.


Are you trying to tell me that he's not a real person?

I need to go lie down and cry myself to sleep now.

PS- good article on net neutrality (http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110008391)

[MaudKip]

What do you think? Just curious about other people's views on it.

I doubt that the so called "takeover" of the internet by giant companies will ever happen: There are simply too many people connected to the Internet.

Discuss your views on the subject.

http://www.savetheinternet.com/ for more information.

I feel that eventually some corporation will attempt, but it will probally not work out.

[Lab0mba]

The internet is the only free "place" in existence. It must be protected at all costs. Anyone who thinks other wise, is the equivalent to Big Brother.

About internet2, well people, imagine transmission speeds faster than that of the transfer rates of SATA. Up to 100 Gbps.

[Napalm]

Then I'm the equivalent to Big Brother.

If you haven't noticed, the internet is not "free".
In the majority of the places visited on the internet, it is a "privilidge" to use their service, and not a right. You can be banned from a website for stating your opinion. I know this isn't the case with the majority of the internet. But you can't call it a place of freedom if it's not 100% freedom. :/

[Shins]

Freedom isn't free™.

[mingus]

What the hell is freedom anyway? Now that that I think about it, that should be a thread...

[Slevin57]

It wouldn't be that hard to regulate the internet.

I mean the government already controls ICANN.... It wouldn't be that hard to use ICANN + AT&T Lines to regulate the internet.

They already do it in other countries with filters.

[MasterGlitch]

Never trust wikipedia. Anyone can post anything on there. I could say that Earth is the 7th planet from the sun and quite frankly 1/1000000 people would believe me.

I could say that Jack Bauer is a real person.

I could say carbon is the first element on the periodic table.

I could say that Tiger Woods is gay.

Doesn't mean it is all true.

For anything you try to post as fact on Wikipedia, you have to provide some kind of source. If you don't, what you say will be followed by a superscript that reads "[citation needed]." And really, there's a lot of geeks and nerds out there who care about the integrity of such things as Wikipedia. They, along with the moderators of the site do their best to either correct false information or put up lots of warning flags telling you that the article shouldn't be totally trusted.
As long as you're not an idiot who believes everything and you only trust the stuff with cited sources, Wikipedia is a great research tool. Granted, it's really only a starting place for in-depth research since fact-checking is sometimes necessary, but it's a really good place to look up random information or kick-start a research session.

And as far as the NSA wire-tapping deal goes, I know that I've never been arrested for what I've said on the phone, and many times I joke with my friends about violent things or explosives. Hell, I talk about video games on the phone. Taken out of context, that alone can sound really bad.
The thing is, the government isn't dumb enough to think that someone who is seriously plotting something would just openly say it. The real threatening people know to use codes and other such things to hide their information, just in case.

I also kinda think that the whole net neutrality issue really isn't an issue right now. No one is trying to take over the internet currently. No one is trying to censor the internet at this time. There is nothing to worry about.
The trick is that if anyone does try to do those things the public should stand up and firmly object. But that's for a later time, when there is a real threat imminent. Why must people worry over things that have not yet become worrysome?

[Kinetix]

It wouldn't be that hard to regulate the internet.

I mean the government already controls ICANN.... It wouldn't be that hard to use ICANN + AT&T Lines to regulate the internet.

They already do it in other countries with filters.


Information on how to bypass china's filters are all over the internet. Filters are the worst way to govern the internet and are easy to bypass if you know your stuff.

Point is even the "highest grade" filters available have their weaknesses, and if they employ it they will have a world of hackers working against them.

[4 h4x0r]

All for net neutrality, its a good thing. I pray to God that the internet stays neutral.

[System_Zero]

And thus so far it has.

But next time try not revive threads that are almost 6 moths old.

[ipwnu]

I'd say it's impossible being that the internet is made up of everyone... but who knows... anything can happen...



What do you think? Just curious about other people's views on it.

I doubt that the so called "takeover" of the internet by giant companies will ever happen: There are simply too many people connected to the Internet.

Discuss your views on the subject.

http://www.savetheinternet.com/ for more information.